Right so let’s cover the recurring issue with Wahoo SYSTM / The Sufferfest, which is that for reasons that remain unknown to me, it reads the correct wattage from my pedals but doesn’t adjust ERG down like every other platform I have used.
Make no sense?
A picture shows it better:
The app is asking me to hit 90 RPM which should translate to 198 watts.
However, I pedal at 90 RPM – any gear – and it puts out ~215-220 watts. Basically 10% higher, regardless of whatever wattage is requested.
This isn’t really noticable at lower wattages. But at higher wattages its not only noticable but its totally killer.
Given the 4DP test put me down at 224w FTP, I’m at about 98% FTP here on what is billed as a tempo ride.
In short:
It makes the app practically unusable.
Beyond the technical issues, which I thought were resolved but sadly do not appear to be, I only had a super short amount of time to ride today.
It’s a meeting heavy day, and outside it’s looking particularly dull and grey. The ever threatened rain has still not materialised, but I didn’t want to chance it by leaving it till early evening.
What that did mean is I had 1.5 minutes at the end of my session to jump off the bike, ‘hot swap’ my clothes, and get onto my next meeting.
Now, I’m so early doors in my new job that the guy on the video call with me was too courteous to call out the fact my top was soaked and I was sweating profusely. But in the end I had to turn off my camera and towel myself down several times. Nasty 🙂
Overall then not the ride I wanted to do today.
Also not the outcome I thought I had achieved and it makes me question whether I can realistically continue with Wahoo SYSTM… haven’t we been here before?
Fortunately I’m still in my free trial so it’s not a big deal.
As this one was zero video, I also got a taste of what it might be like to use something like Trainer Road or Trainer Day.
Basically though, it makes me just think I should go back to Zwift.
Apologies if this is a stupid comment but shouldn’t you be using your smart trainer for wattage rather than your pedals for indoor workouts? By that I mean, don’t establish a connection with the pedals at all but just use your smart trainer in ERG mode. Never had this problem with Trainerroad or Trainerday when paired with my smart trainer.
Not a stupid comment at all 🙂 It’s a very valid point.
My logic behind this is maybe flawed, but here goes:
I use the bike indoors and out. The pedals are always with the bike, so getting a reading from them is constant.
If I use the turbo for wattage indoors and it reads 10% lower than the pedals, I’m getting one set of power readings indoors and a different set for outdoors, so it makes riding to power more confusing.
If I do use the turbo indoors then the figures are ‘correct’ from the turbo, but still higher from the pedals. So I see one set of results on the computer monitor, and still the higher results on the Garmin. Effectively I’m doing the workouts at a higher wattage than is being reported, and it’s super demoralising to fail a workout as I have done in the past because I’m over my limit but not according to the PC.
As far as I know, it’s a fault with the Tacx Neo. There are forum posts about it. There’s no way to calibrate it or anything like that.
Zwift, RGT, and even GTA Cycling didn’t suffer from this though, it’s only ever been a Sufferfest / SYSTM issue unfortunately.
I’m yet to try Trainerroad or other platforms.
“Not a stupid comment at all 🙂 It’s a very valid point.” Phew.
“If I use the turbo for wattage indoors and it reads 10% lower than the pedals, I’m getting one set of power readings indoors and a different set for outdoors, so it makes riding to power more confusing.” Yeah, I get your logic. I suppose as you have noted before in your posts outdoor/indoor workouts are very different things. I don’t have a power meter on my bike as pedals are the only option and I don’t like cleats (same bike as you).
“Effectively I’m doing the workouts at a higher wattage than is being reported, and it’s super demoralising to fail a workout as I have done in the past because I’m over my limit but not according to the PC.” Yeah, tech is great but can be a bit of an arse ache. I never had any of this tech a few years ago and just went out for a bike ride. When I got the tech the stats were great but I’m starting to think they get in the way. I used to just like going out for a nice ride – bit of exercise, nice views – but now when I go out I think all those numbers have soured things a bit. Want to get back to just enjoying a ride and enjoying the views. The Specialized is a great wee bike but thinking about going back to my heavy early 90s mountain bike – burn more calories for the same distance. With the Specialized, because it is light, I have to add many more miles to get the same calorie burn. Ha! Might dig out my old mountain bike tomorrow and go for a ride. I’ll be taking my garmin though to compare the ride with the Specialized – damn tech gets you in the end!
Totally get that, and yeah I think there are rides I’ve had where the tech / stats have made me reconsider having “just a ride” versus feeling like I have to meet certain goals / targets.
Sometimes that’s a good thing, other times less so.
I’ve been riding to power pretty much since day one so I’m maybe my views are completely biased anyway.
I’m of the same opinion regarding buying a lighter bike. As I mainly ride to get exercise it doesn’t really bother me if I’m several seconds (ahem, minutes) off the KoM or whatever. And yeah, I’ve often wondered if a lighter bike would mean I’d have to do more to get the equivalent work out. Not sure how that works – science is not my strong point 🙂
The most useful two things the tech gives me honestly are:
1. Outdoor efforts are easier to judge – I know if I’m doing 20 minutes hard effort I have a good idea what power / watts per kilo I need to be hitting to get the result I want.
2. Same thing really, but for pacing hill climbs. I’ve definitely been guilty of blowing up on some of the harder climbs I’ve done, so being able to see power on anything longer than about a 20 second hill climb is an essential for me now. I really struggle to just wing it as I’m usually massively over.
How are you judging the comparison between pedals and Neo?
A couple of years ago, I used the DC Rainmaker Analyser app to compare my Powertap P1 pedals with my first generation Tacx Neo. It looked as though they were within about 0.75% of each other, so as close as could be expected. These were quite short runs and there always seems to be a lag in the P1 pedals transmitting data, so probably the average power values were closer than that.
I’ll try the DC Rainmaker app.
I’m not at the PC right now to double check this, but from memory:
Connect the Assioma pedals directly to the PC via ANT+ or bluetooth, it didn’t make a difference
At the same time, I could see the 3s power readings on the Garmin head unit.
Pedal on the bike, and see the same power output on the PC and the head unit – but the Wahoo / Sufferfest app does not adjust like Zwift does. It reads 10% higher.
Swap to Tacx Neo 2 (gen 1) for power input on the PC. Keep the Assioma pedals synced to the Garmin.
Pedal on the bike, see 10% lower on the PC but the higher figure on the Garmin.
And for completeness, swap to Neo for both headunit + PC and the figures once again match up – but at the lower values.
I’ll double check this using the third party app as I may be misrepresenting this. It’s from memory as I say.
Thanks for the heads up on the app to try.